Alberta Premier Danielle Smith defended this week the decision to stay the course on an Oct. 19 referendum on immigration, the constitution and separation-related questions while laying out a nuanced response to the ongoing trade war between Canada and the U.S. Meanwhile, calls coming from opposition for the referendum to be either cancelled or postponed continue to grow as tariff disputes ramp up. Thomas Lukaszuk, the lead proponent of the anti-separation Forever Canadian campaign and former deputy premier, weighs in on pro-Canada sentiments with Alberta Primetime’s Michael Higgins. This interview has been edited for length and clarity. Michael Higgins: Your organization is now joining the call to drop the referendum. You’ve officially made that request in a letter to the premier. Why, when you’ve invested so much effort into a campaign that has become very personal? Thomas Lukaszuk: It is personal not only to me, but to the 500,000 Albertans who signed the Forever Canadian petition not to have a referendum. Our position remains: there is a way of resolving this issue in the legislature. A leader of a separatist party in Quebec running on the mandate of separatism sees the wisdom of withholding the referendum right now, because we are literally in an existential crisis with the United States, where our sovereignty is being undermined by foreign powers. This is the last time where we should be dividing ourselves for internal political gain. You would think that the premier of Alberta, who claims to be a federalist, would see the wisdom of pulling this referendum off the shelf and focusing on Team Canada. MH: You mean in terms of Team Canada at a time of a trade war? TL: Right. And joining Prime Minister (Mark) Carney, as all other nine premiers have. Even Premier (Scott) Moe from Saskatchewan sees the wisdom in working hand-in-hand with the prime minister and presenting Canada as a united force in negotiations with the U.S. This referendum, and the conversation about separatism, is just playing to the hand of the U.S. administration. MH: Could it not be argued that having the referendum is a platform for pushing national unity? TL: Canada has never been as united because of the external threats predominantly from the United States. Severing Alberta and creating a situation where, at a time where our businesses need support and Canadian workers need support, is driving investment away from Alberta and undermining our own economy. (It’s) creating a situation where neighbours don’t talk to neighbours anymore. If there ever is a time to do this – this is definitely not the time to do this. This is the time for national unity. If this referendum is so important for the premier’s political survival, because that’s what it’s really about right now, more than 50 per cent of our party members want it, sure, have it. But have it at a time after we stabilize our situation with the United States. Get behind Prime Minister Carney, get behind all nine other premiers, and be a visible proponent of a united Canada. MH: On that point, on the trade war front, what do you make of Team Canada efforts and the role that Alberta is currently playing in that regard? TL: It’s really reassuring to see premiers, irrelevant of what their political stripes are, to be working together and saying, ‘Yes, we are willing to have our provincial economies used as leverage against the U.S.’ Alberta right now is the only outlier that’s saying no, you cannot use oil and gas as leverage against the United States. It’s actually the biggest hammer that we have against the U.S. It’s one of our biggest exports to the U.S. And (we’re) having this divisive referendum at the same time. Our premier is the only premier that is saying we should roll over, play nice. As a matter of fact, she said that we should be so nice that we become irresistible to the United States, and continue negotiating with them, when we know that we had to walk away from the table. All nine other premiers recognize the fact that we had to walk away from the negotiation table because this negotiation has turned into more than just a free trade agreement. It has turned into a negotiation of Canadian sovereignty and our independence from the United States. MH: What worries you, then, about the U.S. getting involved in the separation debate as a factor of this trade war? TL: Canada is only as strong as its weakest link, and Alberta is presenting itself right now in front of the international audience as the weakest link in Canada because we’re being attacked from the outside, while our sovereignty is being questioned and the president continues to refer to us at the 51st state and our prime minister as governor. Our province says, ‘Yeah, we don’t want to be part of this country, and we’re allowing for this conversation to happen.’ This is not making our national position any stronger. It weakens us. MH: On the flip side, how do you feel about former premiers Jason Kenney and Rachel Notley, and what some would say is an unlikely alliance – tag-teaming on a pro-Canada campaign along with the Canadian Chamber of Commerce? TL: I don’t know what the CTV News Edmonton weather forecast is but some may be saying that hell is going to freeze over. But I’m glad to see that. MH: How does it change political dynamics? TL: Those of us who follow politics know that, if not for Jason Kenney, we wouldn’t be in this pickle to begin with, but it is nice that even Jason Kenney at a time like this realizes that joining Team Canada and supporting Canadian independence from the U.S. and protecting our national sovereignty is the right thing to do. It was Jason Kenney who was actually cheering on Brexit. He was part of the foreign interference in the U.K. egging them on, and now he realizes that it wasn’t the right thing to do. And I’m glad to see two former premiers of very diverse political backgrounds working together. There are other pro-unity campaigns in Alberta, and I’m glad to see that because that’s how important it is. All of us are seeing it, except for our premier. We’re seeing that we have to set aside our political ambitions, our political differences, our partisanship, and this is the time where we all unite. We will fight it out later. Our differences, personal differences and political differences. But right now, we’re on Team Canada, and on the outside, we are a solid unit. Alberta has to become part of that unit. MH: Let’s say the premier says, for sure, that we’re not dropping the referendum. Albertans end up voting to send it to a binding referendum. What’s the likelihood that a referendum could happen as early as next spring? TL: The premier has no definition of what a win or a loss is. We don’t know if it’s 50 per cent plus one vote or if it’s 75, or will she say that 25 per cent of Albertans voted for separation, and they deserve to be heard again? Forever Canadian has collected nearly half a million signatures to not have a referendum, and yet we’re having a referendum. Albertans voted against time zone change, and yet we’re having a time zone change. Who knows what she will do with the outcome of this referendum? We know that she has to keep separatists within her own party caucus and cabinet happy, if she’s to survive a leadership review, which she may have this fall. So that’s the problem that we’re dealing with, and yet this premier actually could be the strongest member of Team Canada. She has undeniably strong connections in the United States. She visits Mar-a-Lago. She prides herself in being a good friend of President Trump. This is the time where she actually should use taxpayer dollars and have a message broadcast on all U.S. networks, saying that we are a strong team, to not interfere in our internal politics and she should demand a fair trade deal with the U.S., knowing that they depend on Alberta oil. This is her time to shine.
